There are some things I will never understand. Here are ten of them:
- Why do people think a dog can be judged in the show ring?
Do folks think a beauty pageant is how you find a friend, an employee, an athlete, or a paragon of genetic health? - Why is breeding dogs a "sport"?
Is star-gazing a sport? How about stamp collecting? Crochet? Nintendo? Writing? - Why do people think poodles were once found in the wild?
Has it escaped their notice that feral dogs do not devolve to wolves? It is too much to think that a dog might simply be a dog, just as a coyote is a coyote, and a pigeon is a pigeon? - Why do some people think the natural diet of dogs is frozen chicken and cubed beef?
Are they unaware that the "natural diet" of the dog is rotten food on a garbage heap? Do they not know that the preferred diet of the wolf is the torn rectum of a sick and dying animal? Have they not seen their own dogs delight in eating green grass and excrement? Is it too shocking an idea that bagged kibble might be fine? - Why do so many people buy carefully bred hunting dogs, and then not hunt them?
Do these people buy expensive wines in order to read the labels? Do they buy racing cars to park them in the driveway? - Why do some people inbreed dogs in order to express genetic defects?
Are these folks having children with their siblings in order to see if their own family carries the genes for diabetes, epilepsy, cancer, or hemophilia? - Why is a lap dog invented in 1863 called an "important breed," while today's cross bred is described as "just another designer mutt"?
Do people really believe the potted histories printed in all-breed books? Do they not know that dog dealers have always been with us? - Why is a suburban rosette chaser a "canine hobbyist" but everyone else is a "backyard breeder?"
When push comes to shove, how many of either group health tests their dogs, works their dogs, and tracks the health and work history of their progeny over multiple generations? - Why do people ignore the emotional needs of animals?
How is it OK to keep dogs in Kennels or cages for weeks on end without letting them out? Convicted murderers get more yard time that many of the dogs found in large kennels. - Why do Kennel Club breeders think anyone should listen to them?
Their animals are not healthier than random-bred dogs, and almost no Kennel Club dog can be found at the race track, on the farm, in the field, or pulling a sled. So why is anyone listening to them?
18 comments:
Good thoughts. Personally I don't understand human "beauty contests" either. How can a person be judged on their external packaging rather than their actions? Beauty is far too subjective to be applying great worth to any animal, including humans, for it.
The rotting thing: my dachshund Mia would be a prime example of this. When walking, if there is a dead critter of any kind, she makes a bee line right for it. She also appreciates "treats" from the cat box, she is untrainable when it comes to getting into the garbage. I won't go into the feminine products nightmare, only suffice to say it was quickly learned to empty the bathroom trash immediately when one appeared or shut the door.
Come on, have you never seen cave paintings of wild poodles, complete with trimmed fur and bow, following their masters on the hunt?
5) b. Yes. (Or garage.) Luckily for the cars, they don't care. The dogs do. Sigh. I'll take my shorthairs somewhere, a passerby will strike up a conversation -
Passerby: "What nice dogs!"
Me: "Thanks"
Conversation about what they are, etc.
P: "I'd love to have one!"
M: "Do you hunt?"
P: blank stare
M: "Then you don't want or need one."
In related news - check my FB stuff for a rauhaar teckel pup that I have dibs on - bunnies, deer tracking and maybe some earthdog work.
Very good points! There is very little that separates a "reputable" show breeder from a puppy factory. It's a question of why they breed: ego or money.
In my breed, about 10% of the so called "reputable" show breeders perform the genetic testing they have abailable to improve their beloved breed. And the majority don't consider their dogs as companion animals, keeping them in kennels 24/7.
No wonder the purebred dog fancy has found itself siding with the puppy millers on legislative issues. It's not a function of "great minds" thinking alike. It's about preserving their egos or their wallets.
That's because people like the idea of dogs and not the actual organism.
BTW, there is a dog that became a wolf. The dingo came to Australia with floppy ears and some with curled tails. They were fully domesticated or pariah dog types. (They have been in Australia for only 3,500 years.) With no garbage to eat, they became something like a wolf. In this case, an Arabian wolf, not the big game hunting wolves. Dingoes look and act very much like Arabian wolves. Comparing dogs with those highly specialized wolves is a waste of time.
I think if humans were to disappear, and our garbage dumps, too, then dogs would evolve back to the wolfish form. But garbage keeps them dogs. It's far easier to eat garbage and scavenge than learn pack hunting behavior and then evolve back to the wolf.
"Why do some people inbreed dogs in order to express genetic defects?
Are these folks having children with their siblings in order to see if their own family carries the genes for diabetes, epilepsy, cancer, or hemophilia?"
Love this one! It always baffles me when the answer of "in order to express genetic defects is given" to the question of why inbreed.
There are plenty of insufferable D-bags in the purebred dog fancy, no doubt. There's also a lot of plain ignorance that has nothing to do with malice or money.
To an extent it's a generational issue. I think you'll find a lot of the 'younger' breeders (I'm 42 and count myself amongst them) have a better baseline education in math and science than many of our predecessors; so, when someone tries to feed us 19th century nonsense we can cry 'bullshit' and move along to someone more sensible.
We health test, breed carefully, pay attention to COI's, and generally just show for fun. I enjoy winning -- especially beating the insufferable D-bags, but if I never went to another show, I'd still love my dogs and appreciate them just as much.
#2 Why is breeding dogs a "sport"?
Is star-gazing a sport? How about stamp collecting? Crochet? Nintendo? Writing?
Star-gazing
Stamps
Crochet
Gaming
Writing
Set up some stakes and anything can turn into a competition.
Terrierman - I am the owner of two terriers. One of them is AKC registerd the other is not. Both dogs have participated in earthdog trials and other terrier trials.
I do agree with a few of your 10 points but I think you are over generalizing on many of your points and in my opinion you have in some used what I feel is faulty logic or little hard data.
My comments on some of your comments:
#1 - Judging conformation dogs in the show ring where the purpose is to evaluate the conformation, movement and how a particular dog compares to the established breed standard structurally - where would you propose it be done?
#2 - Croquet has a ball, a mallet, combined with a win/lose scenario - that pretty much sums much of what we define as sport. Also one of the definitions of sport is "diversion; recreation, pleasant pastime" among other definitions - so it is a pretty loose term.
#8 - "suburban rosette chaser" These people exist in just about any hobby, sport or endeavor that involves competition, judges and/or awards they are not unique to dog shows and dog shows are not the reason they exist. You could eliminate all forms of competition and these people still exist. It's often an issue of low self esteem nothing really to do with the dogs.
#10 - Why not? Why does being a Kennel Club memeber mean they couldn't possibly have more knowledge than a layman?know anything worth listening to? While your comments indicate otherwise there are plenty of people who are kennel club members, have dogs with conformation titles AND performance titles, enjoy their dogs, don't inbreed and some of them probably know more than you do. I'm not sure why the fact that race track dogs are not kennel club registerd is a fault - I think that is a point in their favor. It woud be fair to say that many people consider the the life of a racing greyhound to be a substandard existance. (at least as you define it in #9 of your list)
#5 - I really was puzzled by your 5th point - because actually as far as I know there are plenty of people who buy racing cars and park them in their driveways. So the analogy of people buying things and then not using them for their intended purpose is hardly limited to the the non-hunting owners of hunting dogs. My question back to you is why do you think the only useful purpose of a hunting dog is to hunt? Most dogs have many traits that make them desirable as pets. Perhpas the question that we should be asking is how can those of use who have dog knowledge do a better job of educating prospective dog owners in the importance of selecting a puppy/dog with traits that fit into their lifestyle in terms of energy, excercise, size, tempermant, etc...
Traits which by the way are usually more predictable in the lines of carefully and thoughtfully bred dogs. The type of dogs with many generations of documented breeding which are bred and registerd by many active members of kennel clubs.
Do you really think your nice hunting terriers happened by chance? Would you accept any dog as a replacement for your terriers? If not then I suggest you might be a little more supportive of responsible breeders because without them you would not be enjoying your terriers and if the animal rights groups have their way - someday there will be no more purbred dogs.
As they say - be careful what you wish for...
Little White Dogs, you are a perfect example of a type, and that type is warmly embraced at AKC earthdog trials where ignorance is king and fantasy is treated as a feature, not a liability. Have fun there, but know that what is being done is not work, and that the AKC has never made a working breed, but only ruined them. No doubt your breed is a perfect example of what I am talking about, and without a doubt you are helping contribute to its rapid demise as a working dog (if in fact it ever was a working dog).
To think that a dog can be evaluated for "movement" in a ring, and that "conformation" is important to a terrier, is to let the flag of ignorance fly with a full marching band down front. So too is the notion that all competition is sport. Here's a hint: It's not. A sport is a physical activity that involves exertion, skill, and sweat. It involves muscles. It is NOT a game of scrabble! Sporting goods stores do not sell poker cards, or knitting needles, chess sets, or dog leashes, do they? No.
My dogs were made by people who dig on their dogs. They were not made to a conformation standard, nor were they made to be judged at the end of a string leash by someone talking about movement. Working terriers are made by judging the work. That idea is clearly so foreign to you that you have no idea what it means. Running dogs that compete on a string lead are better than those that compete at the track? As far as you are concerned it is a GOOD thing that a running dog never faces a competition other than a visual on? No doubt you also think a sled dog should never pull on anything tougher than a string lead, and that a terrier should never suffer a gash from a nast fox? And you seem to think that racing greyhounds never leave their kennels? Woooeee! Thanks for sharing. I rest my case: Why would anyone every listen to anyone in the AKC? No one who has the slightest knowledge of dogs would ever defend that system.
P.
Thank you so much for now flinging your insults at me. Where in my post did I attack you personally? Did I ever say that your terriers were any less dear than mine? Did I ever say that what you do with your terriers is wrong? .
What I took issue with were some of your points and the way your stated them - there is a difference between attacking what is being presented and the person who is presenting it.
I am very much concerned with many of the issues seen in the dog show ring - however rather than sit on the sidlines and sling insults. I decided to see what is going on with my own eyes. I may never enter the show ring again but I think I can establish that perhaps I have some ability to comment. You have never really stated if you ever showed or are just basing your opinion on heresay. I can tell you first hand there ARE people with the best interest of their terriers who show. Not everyone is as you describe. Are there some who are only there for a beauty pageant and rosettes? Of course there are and as I said previously these people exist EVERYWHERE in any sport, hobby whatever you want to call it!
YOU may define a sport as something that involves physicial exertion and that is ONE of the definitions. But let's take YOUR definition and examine it. Say I grant you the assumptioin that sport must invole physicial exertion. Does that make riding horses a sport? I am amazed at how many people say is is not. Clearly in terms of calories burned muscles used, strength required it would seem to fall within your categorization of sport. So then take the next step what if the Croquet player is 90 years old and it is an exertion for him or her? Does it then qualify as sport? Take that a step further could dog showing possibly be a sport for someone who is wheelchair bound or in some other way physically challenged? Granted this does not make all dog showing meet your definition - I'm simply playing devil's advocate and showing you that what to you inoles no exertion could perhaps be quite challenging to another. And in the end WHO CARES?
Its a shame you judge my participation in earthdog as being sustandard rahter than embrace me as perhaps someone who is learning the skills needed to graduate into field hunting. Does my dog know the difference? Is he having any less of a good time going through man made earths as those that are natural?
Well there is really no point in my going on - it is clear you have made your judgement against me and deemed me unworthy. The interesting things is that when I was first searaching to find a place to do hunt my dogs and learn about about earthdogs I thought your site was quite informative - it was later when the tone of your postings took on a negative, judgemental tone that I started to become concerned that perhaps you did not realize that your assumption that your way is the only right way is what in the long run is going to allow the animal rights groups like PETA and HSUS to put an end to any of us enjoying our terriers doing what they were bred to do.
I'm so sorry that you can't see that we actually probably agree on more things than we disagree on and that if you want to effect positive change then posting these negative postings doesn't accomplish that - you just make things worse.
Yes, honey I have shown dogs -- lots of nights in bad hotels and at the request of a breeder. Did well. Big deal. Terriers were not made for string leads, were they? The dogs were not created by a closed registry, were they? But that is what the AKC is about.
Sorry if your feelings were hurt, but Kennel Club apologists, such as yourself, result in defect, deformity and disease for the dogs, and not much else. I am sure you mean well, but so did Hitler when he embraced the same kind of eugenics theories that underpin the Kennel Club. Meaning well is not the test is it? Doing well by the dogs is the test, and the Kennel Club has not done well there, has it? No. The jury is no longer out on that!
Question: When is the Kennel Club going to apologize to the dogs? When are the people who fund the Kennel Club, going to apologize to the dogs?
There is nothing wrong with earthdog trials, but it's a game that encourages fantasy which leads to defect. The interiour measurements of an earthdog liner are 81 square inches. The interior of a fox sette is that of a round pipe of 6" -- less than 29 square inches. A big fox chest is 14 inches in circumference. If you do not dig, you have no idea what is needed in a working terrier, and so you cannot breed a dog that is correct for work, except as an accident. And it's not just size is it? Can the dog find in all weather? How do you know if it has not worked two or three seasons in all weather? Will the dog give voice when it finds? Will it learn what to do when it faces different animals in different situations, or will it get knackered every time? If you do not dig, you will never know, and so you are breeding blind and the result is what we see in the AKC today -- dogs that cannot work, dogs that do not work, dogs that are selected for mutation and deformity, and dogs that are inbred to the point of misery and disease.
And are apologies being made to the dogs? No, of course not. Because for people in the AKC, it's not really about the dogs, is it? It's about rosettes for the owners. That is what the AKC is selling, and that is what AKC supporters are buying. Not healthier dogs. Not dogs that can work. Not better companions. Sorry, we do not sell salves for human ego here. Seek that medicine elsewhere. Your comfort lies in the AKC.
P.
If you want to compare me to Hitler I can't stop you even though I find it absurd.
I really would like to hear what your plan of action is to prevent PETA and HSUS from banning all hunting of live quarry? I'm sure in they find your participation in field hunting reprehensible and I can assure you they are well on their way to passing legislation to ban your right to hunt your dogs.
No matter how reprehensible you find the AKC it is one of the largest groups of dog owners that has some level of influence and if all of us could put aside some of these differences perhpas we could collectives fend off what I feel is the true enemy to our dogs and our right to work our dogs.
Do you realize that when you speak out against all members of the AKC and pur bred dog breeders in this public forum that you are feeding into the very arguments that PETA is using to take away your rights?
Those very people you don't understand who buy hunting dogs but don't hunt far outnumber those of you left who do use your dogs for their intended purpose. These dog owners are the onew who are easily influenced by statements made by PETA and likely there are many out there who may be agreeing with what they read on your blog.
What I don't understand is why you can't see that your sweeping generalizations and condemnation of all people any way affiliatied with the AKC are in the long run going to increase the probability and speed by which PETA achieves its goals.
So while it appears that I have no hope of changing your mind. I do at least thank you for approving my comments so the others who stop by this blog might see that not everyone who is in a kennel club is as you would portray them and that the time has come for us to work together to preserve our rights to work our terriers even if we don't agree on all things.
Peace to you and safe hunting
Lady, you are certified moron.
Seriously. You know nothing about the AKC. If you did, you would know their history or at least look it up.
The good thing about ignorance, however is that it is a treatable disease. Here's your first dose towards a cure: it' called "The Eugenics Man and the Kennel Club". You read how the AKC was saluting their very own in-house eugenicist and Hitler correspondent just a few years back >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/12/eugenics-man-at-kennel-club.html
As to PETA, you know nothing about them either. If you did, you would know I live in the state where PETA is headquatered, that I am in the phone book, and I fear nothing and neither does anyone else. Hunting is written into the Virginia constitution, for God's sake, while nationally, the Congressional Sportsman's Caucus is the largest on Capitol Hill.
Of course, all of this is news to you because you know as much about hunting as you do about dogs.
But this is how it is with the show-ring pretenders and fantasy folks. They have wrecked working dogs, they have bred them to pain, misery and dysfunction. But point it out, and they screat PeTA, and claim hunting is threatened if we do not march lock-step with them around the ring with string leads in hand. Nonsense! Complete and utter crap.
P
*sigh* You can call me a moron and say I am ingnorant. I never claimed to be all knowing.
You are fortunate to live in Virginia. A state with some of the most beautiful countryside I have ever seen. My dogs and I envy you in this regard.
I have never asked you to "march lock step" into the show ring. That was never the intent behind my comments - now that you have provided more information I am wondering if you had direct interactions with some of the worst examples of pure bred dog owners in existence - because you have made it quite clear you consider me and any one who even remotely associates with the AKC to be bunch of Hitler youth on the rise.
I'm not following your train of thought where you state that I know nothing about PETA because they are headquartered in VA. and your being in the phone book and having no fear of them. You will have to elaborate a little more there. I would happily be proved to be a moron in this regard - because PETA and HSUS do frighten me. Maybe the future of dog owners looks bright from your vantage point in VA but in my state - MA there has been legislation introduced that threatened my ability to freely make decisions on on such things as which vacinations to give my dog or cat and at what age and also regulations requiring me to spay/neuter my dog unless I was given permission and willing to pay to keep my animal intact beyond the age of 6 months. Luckily we were able to get the bill sent back to comittee but it is not 100% dead.
I may be a moron - but to me that legislation combined with the fact that greyhound racing has been banned in MA sure feels like a significant step towards one day banning my right to possibly hunt or make my own decisions on what to do with my dogs.
I thank you for information about the Sportsman Caucus - I will look for some information on that because while I'll take your word that they are looking out for the protection of our rights to hunt our dogs - I'm not yet convinced they are the the most influential body on capitol hill.
You can call me some more names if you choose to - I can handle it and seperate your virtual "bark" from some of your more factual "bites" and maybe you will realize that not many would tolerate your insults and most would simply walk away and not ever stick around to try and understand your point of view.
You could be so much more effective in educating other dog owners if you could perhaps tone down the negative generalizations and insults.
Respectfully,
The "moron" in MA.
LittleWhiteDogs,
As I said before you are a perfect example of your type: the ignorant AKC apololgist who just prattles on.
You know nothing about the Congressional Sportman's Caucus because you do not read. Here's a hint: there are posts on this very blog about them, and about America's hunting Supreme Court, hunting Presidents, and our hunting legislatures too.
You know nothing about the health of pedigree dogs even though there are entire TV shows, magazine articles, and data sets on this blog (and everywhere else!) detailing what the 19th Century eugenics theories of the Kennel Club have done to the dogs.
You sound like are new to dogs, which would not be a surprise. The average Kennel Club person is in and out after less than five years, leaving a legacy of wreckage behind them.
You decry Greyhound racing as evil and cruel, and then say you think its absence in MA is a sign that PeTA is just around the corner to ban hunting, proving you are now just typing complete nonsense, and know nothing about hunting or dogs, in MA or anywhere else.
Why not look up the hunting stats for MA? Why not look up the dog ownership stat for MA? How about actually doing research before you type in ignorance? If you are frightened of PeTA, then you are simply ignorant of PeTA, dito for HSUS. You have no idea who these people are, or how weak they are, or why legislation is passed. No doubt electricity is a mystery too.
I could go on, but you are a time-waster, a zombie and an anonymous cowward and I do not waste my time on such people as anyone who reads this blog knows. See >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/01/zombies-time-wasters-and-anonymous.html
Don't let the door hit you on the butt on your way out.
P
While PETA and HSUS are obnoxious publicity whores, the real "threat" to dogs comes from the fact Animal Care and Control services have been treated like the rest of our neglected infrastructure in the US. While populations in areas boomed, A/C budgets and shelter space have been static or declining. Fortunately, behavior over the last 20 years has shifted reducing the need for shelters particularly in the north-east where they import rescues.
In the relatively ruralcounty where I live, population grew at 17% a year for 8 or 9 years while shelter intake grew at only 8-9%. That's a 'win' statistically as euthanasia per capita declined during that time; however, in absolute terms the shelter is full and 70% of the dogs that walk in do not walk back out. A/C is out of space and money.
Like you, I have nothing to fear, and I spoke candidly at a public hearing recently regarding proposed, sweeping changes to our local A/C ordinances. The changes were drafted by the Sheriff's department with the help of their 'partners' they see in the shelter all the time -- rescue groups, the local vet society, etc. The resulting ordinance is about what you'd expect including a MSN component and new, mandatory vet care requirements (gee, as the heartworm racket isn't profitable enough).
The hearing was full of "irresponsible owners" talk, but in reality, the County Commissioners have to share some of the blame. Arguably, the County's owners are becoming more and more responsible as has been the trend nationwide. The County has failed to adequately address A/C in it's planning process.
Well said Carolyn Horowitz!
Animal control operations are done on the cheap and the result is unnecessary misery and death.
Though everyone wants to talk about the failure of responsibility of individuals (and there is no shortage of that), the failure of communities is a more important part of the historical package. I have a long post on that, which is essentially a long review of Nathan Winograd's book, which details the history >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2007/10/beyond-blue-solution.html
Another factor in the misery of dogs is the fact that the puppy mill industry (purveyor of throw-away dogs) is sustained by the AKC. I detail that relationship here >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2008/02/akc-loves-puppy-mills-and-naive.html
P.
Well said Mr. Burns. I have Borzoi, and I hunt with them. I work them to ensure they are what they should be. Only then do I consider that any one individual that I own might have something to offer the gene pool for the betterment of the breed. I have done my time in the show ring, and what passes for Borzoi (and wins), for the most part turns my stomach.
How can one say that a particular dog is a good example of a Borzoi if they have never seen that dog hunt? They can't.
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