A fellow from the UK sailed into my Facebook comments a bit all-over-the-map.
He said wild animals don’t use punishment (bullshit) and that all consequences should be natural, and to let dogs fight until one absolutely kicks the other’s ass.
No, he did not have terriers or pit bulls. A pointer-setter guy. I’m pretty sure he’s never sewed up a dog.
He posted a link to himself with a couple of dozen setters in a heavily fenced field doing a down-stay.
And guess how he taught that down-stay?
He never said, but I knew.
The fellow who said punishment is bad, and all consequences should be natural, taught that down-stay the old-fashioned way, with a check cord, pushing down and pinning the dog, and repeatedly popping it on top of the head when the dog tried to get up.
And yes, there’s video of it, and I posted it.
Of course it’s a method as old as time. As I noted:
The point here is a simple one: while there may be “nothing new under the sun” there are newer, faster, and sometimes better ways of getting things done. Indoor plumbing is better than an outhouse, but both work. A gas stove is better than a campfire or hearth, but both work. A chainsaw is better than an ax, but both work.
And can you train a dog with a check cord alone?
Sure. Step on the leash. Pop it on the head. Jerk on a slip collar.
And repeat, repeat, repeat .... because with distance you will lose both timing and consistency.
That’s how we all did it. It works, same as an ax and an outhouse.
Is it more coercive? Is it slower? I think so, on both counts.
But train however you want. A man who has felled 5 trees with an ax sees no reason to be evangelical about chainsaws.
But have you actually TRIED a chainsaw?
What make and model?
And did you read the manual and get a few minutes instruction, or did you just slam it against a tree same as the ax?
Let us know!
By the way, the video this gentleman produced back in 1997 is excellent and informative, and I am not quibbling in the slightest with the method used. As I said, this is how we all did it.
No, he did not have terriers or pit bulls. A pointer-setter guy. I’m pretty sure he’s never sewed up a dog.
He posted a link to himself with a couple of dozen setters in a heavily fenced field doing a down-stay.
And guess how he taught that down-stay?
He never said, but I knew.
The fellow who said punishment is bad, and all consequences should be natural, taught that down-stay the old-fashioned way, with a check cord, pushing down and pinning the dog, and repeatedly popping it on top of the head when the dog tried to get up.
And yes, there’s video of it, and I posted it.
Of course it’s a method as old as time. As I noted:
We all did some variation of this in the 1980s, 1990s, and early 2000s. Me too.
Some stepped on a leash. Some pushed dogs down and pinned them. Some folks threw knotted rope or a light chain at a dog that busted. Some popped them on the head with their hand or snapped a flat cap at them.
Guess what?
It’s all punishment.
What’s interesting is that you do not see what others see.
Those dogs doing a down? Some are cowering.
Trained... but not with a particularly light hand.
Now here’s the thing: you can still train this way and get these same results. But it’s a bit like chopping wood with an ax: slow, and the boards you get in the end may be a bit rough.
Training and proofing with an e-collar and a treat bag is done much the same, but punishment comes with a lighter hand, there’s less hand shyness, and it’s quicker because timing is better and correction can be done at a distance not possible with a check cord.
Have you ever used a modern e-collar? Not a hot ‘buster’ collar sold on ebay for 30 pounds, but a modern collar that will set you back about 175 pounds and comes with 100 levels of stimulation as well as vibration? What make and model? Post a picture.
I’ve trained with twine and switch. Have you trained with a modern e-collar?
The point here is a simple one: while there may be “nothing new under the sun” there are newer, faster, and sometimes better ways of getting things done. Indoor plumbing is better than an outhouse, but both work. A gas stove is better than a campfire or hearth, but both work. A chainsaw is better than an ax, but both work.
And can you train a dog with a check cord alone?
Sure. Step on the leash. Pop it on the head. Jerk on a slip collar.
And repeat, repeat, repeat .... because with distance you will lose both timing and consistency.
That’s how we all did it. It works, same as an ax and an outhouse.
Is it more coercive? Is it slower? I think so, on both counts.
But train however you want. A man who has felled 5 trees with an ax sees no reason to be evangelical about chainsaws.
But have you actually TRIED a chainsaw?
What make and model?
And did you read the manual and get a few minutes instruction, or did you just slam it against a tree same as the ax?
Let us know!
By the way, the video this gentleman produced back in 1997 is excellent and informative, and I am not quibbling in the slightest with the method used. As I said, this is how we all did it.
But is it force-free and entirely natural, and non-coercive? Nope.
And is it much different than the way we do it it now with an e-collar assist? Nope, not really.
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