tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post8338214276574605272..comments2024-03-26T22:16:26.572-04:00Comments on Terrierman's Daily Dose: The Dalmatian Club Embraces Purity and PainPBurnshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-14480171221819438752014-01-18T05:57:53.646-05:002014-01-18T05:57:53.646-05:00Hard science is not about opinion. You can have an...Hard science is not about opinion. You can have an opinion about tax rates, but you cannot have one about whether two plus two equals four. There are only two causes of deafness: genetic, and external damage due to disease, a blow, or a foreign body. The point just made is fundamental. So too is the fact that the piebald and dapple genes do no operate exactly the same, as it relates to deafness, from one breed to another. Again, this is fundamental. Please research before commenting and cite sources. Sadly, a glancing conversation with someone does not actually convey expertise or knowledge on a topic.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-46558892801979550372014-01-17T18:44:54.911-05:002014-01-17T18:44:54.911-05:00As a contrast to pigment-related deafness, there i...As a contrast to pigment-related deafness, there is a recessive gene for deafness in breeds such as Dobermans and Rottweilers that is (obviously) independent from coat color or lack thereof. That is what I would consider to be a true genetic deafness rather than deafness that results secondarily from a loss of pigment. JMO, not wanting to split hairs but something to consider.Liberty Bellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01177305529757660312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-40695071612800800432014-01-17T18:19:06.466-05:002014-01-17T18:19:06.466-05:00Hi Patrick,
I've done a great deal of resear...Hi Patrick,<br /> <br />I've done a great deal of research on this as our breed was considering whether or not to DQ merle from our breed standard (Pomeranians). I've corresponded with Dr. Strain and with Dr. Clark at Clemson and read the information from Sponenberg. Permit me to share some of what I have learned here. <br />The whiteness of the coat at birth in many breeds, including the Dalmatian, is due to piebald genetics. The stronger the expression of the piebald gene, the greater amount of areas of the coat will be white. Many breeds such as Dalmatians, Papillons, Bull terriers and cocker spaniels have varying degrees of piebalding. Some dogs like Tollers may have just a white tip of the tail and white toes. Others are all white except for some color over the face, ears and eyes The last place for the pigment to disappear is usually the head and in some breeds only the ears retain melanin/color. When the pigment suppression occurs over the entire body and the dog is completely white at birth, including the head and the ears, the dog stands a much greater chance of also lacking pigment cells (melanocytes) in the stria vascularis of the inner ear. If melanocytes are not present in the inner ear, deafness will result. <br />The spots of the Dalmatian are caused by a different gene than the piebald gene. These spots are not present at birth and develop shortly thereafter. It is considered a type of ticking.<br />Although Dr. Strain is not a canine geneticist, he is a deafness researcher who has performed a great deal of studies on dogs. His studies have shown that a dog with a patch of color somewhere...anywhere...on the body, has a greatly reduced deafness risk compared to an all-white dog like a white bull terrier or a Dalmatian born completely white. <br />However, a Dalmatian that is born with a patch, say a black ear perhaps, is disqualified per the standard and most breeders won't keep them. It's pretty sad and an example of breed standard that is detrimental to health in a very fundamentally destructive manner. <br />There is a similar process involved with merle genetics. Homozygous merles who have very little color in the coat have a greater chance of deafness due to lack of pigment in the inner ear than does a dog with more pigment in the coat. That is why heterozygous merles, who have quite a bit of color in the coat, are rarely deaf, but homozygous merles with a large amount of white in the coat, are often deaf. <br />This is pretty much consistent through all the breeds except for the Catahoula. In that breed there seems to be a lesser amount of deafness in the homozygous merles than in other breeds. Sheila Schmutz did a study on exceessive white Australian Shepherds, which tested as homozygous merles, and all but one of the homozygotes was deaf in one or both ears. <br />It's not the gene per se, be it piebalding or merle, that causes deafness, it is the secondary suppression of pigment in the inner ear as a result of the piebalding gene or the merle gene. Interestingly, dogs that are white or near white like Samoyeds who are not genetically piebald or merle are not affected by pigment-related deafness. Liberty Bellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01177305529757660312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-70739095259159908522014-01-17T17:12:48.074-05:002014-01-17T17:12:48.074-05:00.
Pigmentation IS inherited.
The Dalamation'....<br />Pigmentation IS inherited. <br /><br />The Dalamation's spots are specifically caused by the extreme piebald allele. <br /><br />Whiteness alone is NOT determinant of deafness, thought it does increase the chance of deafness in most breeds. <br /><br />See "Genetics of Deafness in Dogs" at >> http://www.lsu.edu/deafness/genetics.htm<br />PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-37147684874119151602014-01-17T14:52:47.000-05:002014-01-17T14:52:47.000-05:00When it comes to the issue of deafness in Dalmatia...When it comes to the issue of deafness in Dalmatians, it is not a problem that is inherited as may be commonly assumed. It is a problem related to lack of pigment. All studies that have been done to date on Dalmatians indicate that being born with a patch of color (usually on the head or ears) dramatically reduces the risk of deafness.<br />But God forbid that a dog should have a patch on its head, and not small round spots on an all-white background. <br />Not only does the DCA prohibit the backcross dogs, who have been selected for the normal LUA gene for many generations, but the breed standard itself DISQUALIFIES any dog born with a patch (patch of color, usually on the ear or head somewhere). <br />Apparently, cute little spots are way more important than the ability to hear.Liberty Bellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01177305529757660312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-37287583286279130242011-09-18T07:03:11.658-04:002011-09-18T07:03:11.658-04:00I am cheered by the Dalmatian Club's change of...I am cheered by the Dalmatian Club's change of heart on opening their stud books. I think this is partly a generational thing. Younger people coming into the dog fancy are less hung up on the old prejudices. <br /><br />And the AKC, being dominated by the old guard, is slow to change, but it, too is coming around - albeit at glacial speed.<br /><br />One thing though: you mention the AKC's rules on opening stud books. In fairness to the AKC, you should keep in mind that the 2002 ruling that said that a parent club would need a supermajority and that the AKC would still be able to overrule it was in response to a club that asked to CLOSE their stud book, not one that wanted to open it.<br /><br />That was a particularly contentious case, because the general membership of that parent club had voted to keep the stud book open to dogs from the working registry, and the breed club's directors voted, against the members wishes, to request that the stud book be closed. <br /><br />So...the AKC doesn't always make the wrong decision.Her Royal Highness Pookiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04613946096881373855noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-71232740212261275762009-11-05T17:23:45.071-05:002009-11-05T17:23:45.071-05:00I love Dalmatians. I currently live with two of t...I love Dalmatians. I currently live with two of the sweetest Dali's ever. It is good to see someone speaking out about how badly these beautiful dogs can be treated. they do suffer health problems, and the purer they are...the worse they get. Mine are all papered and they have had hip trouble and kidney trouble. Poor babies!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-62461304935424246362008-12-20T00:26:00.000-05:002008-12-20T00:26:00.000-05:00Thanks for this great post. Terrierman I am just l...Thanks for this great post. Terrierman I am just loving this series you have been doing on dog breeding and hope that it helps reach those who really don't know any better and influences those who really do know.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-9488471125470907392008-12-19T15:49:00.000-05:002008-12-19T15:49:00.000-05:00How disappointing. I've always been an APBT girl m...How disappointing. I've always been an APBT girl myself, but about a year ago I met my first Dal. It was my first encounter with one, and I was smitten. She was charming, adorable, and smart. Her owners were starry-eyed over her and we chatted for quite a while. Since then, I've often thought about adding a rescue Dal to the family, but was distressed by this post. Still, it's good information to have. Much of the world hates and fears pit bulls, but maybe that's a good thing, as it's protected them from the AKC.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-18266472312059485832008-12-14T11:48:00.000-05:002008-12-14T11:48:00.000-05:00I have to disagree with "Retrievermans" conclusion...I have to disagree with "Retrievermans" conclusion that ALL Dalmations are "screwy" and their only purpose was to make rich carriage riders look fashionable--this is from someone who was raised by a Dalmation, and would not be alive to write this if it had not been for that dog's incredible protectiveness and good judgement during numerous dangerous adventures! Dalmations, as coach dogs, had to be incredibly athletic to keep up with the carriages all day, able to herd livestock off the roads(cattle and sheep, etc. often blocking traffic), keep stray dogs and territorial attacking dogs from the horses and carriage, and guard same horses and carriage every night wherever they spent the night--a LOT of versatile responsibility for any dog, and of inestimable value to their owners, far above and beyond just looking fashionable! Could today's Dalmations perform these many duties reliably? That is what they should be bred for instead of show conformation dogs. Sure, hardly anyone rides around in carriages anymore, but I am sure some sensible substitutes could be conjured up, by those who love Dalmations and are interested in FUNCTION, HEALTH, and TEMPERMENT....L.B.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-37002126150429217682008-12-12T19:04:00.000-05:002008-12-12T19:04:00.000-05:00Anon, have you seen this 1790 print?Anon, have you seen <A HREF="http://www.mediastorehouse.com/pictures_588678/BEWICK-DALMATIAN.html" REL="nofollow">this 1790 print?</A>Paihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14108169893140762249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-68853584623428274382008-12-05T21:40:00.000-05:002008-12-05T21:40:00.000-05:00I have looked at literally thousands of sporting a...I have looked at literally thousands of sporting art prints and paintings and have seen only one, possibly two works of art that depict a Dalmatian type dog in them one of them done in the 20th century. Most that depict any dogs by the carriages or coaches mainly have terriers in them, with the occasional spaniel or retriever.<BR/><BR/>I have to wonder if the romantic "history" of the Dalmatian is another one totally made up because artwork of the day does not convey they were popular carriage dogs in the 1600's, 1700's or 1800's.<BR/><BR/>M EvansAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-31208251545666176452008-12-05T17:03:00.000-05:002008-12-05T17:03:00.000-05:00The more I researched about the AKC, the less I wa...The more I researched about the AKC, the less I wanted to get involved in showing dogs. When I first got my purebred this year, I read up voraciously on the subject and was really getting interested in shows, but the more I learned the more disappointed and disgusted I got with the entire thing and with many of the people in it.<BR/><BR/>The only show/registry I have any modicum of respect for now is the UKC, and I wish more breeders who truly loved their dogs would be strong like these Dal folks and break away to form their own private, ethical breed registries and clubs. Then they would REALLY be working to preserve their breed, instead of just paying lipservice to that while condoning the truly diseased mentality of so many AKC and AKC breed clubs.Paihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14108169893140762249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-19673145094750522372008-12-05T11:05:00.000-05:002008-12-05T11:05:00.000-05:00A relative took in a Dalmatian.He was quite possib...A relative took in a Dalmatian.<BR/><BR/>He was quite possibly the most scatter-brained dog I've ever seen.<BR/><BR/>He actually loved other dogs, which is against his breed stereotype. And that was his main redeeming characteristic. He was not deaf. He was unbelievably stupid.<BR/><BR/>But he was cute as puppy.<BR/><BR/>The Dalmatian Club also holds onto the unlikely story that this breed is from Croatia. It is more like a cross between pointers and setters and bull and terriers in England. Why do I think this? Well, the FCI tried to change its country of origin based on some research. Croatia threw a fit (it was then a republic in Yugoslavia). And then there are the nonstandard marked Dals:<BR/><BR/>http://www.geocities.com/paisleydals/color.html<BR/><BR/>All of them suggest pointer/setter and bull and terrier ancestry.<BR/><BR/>There are also long-haired Dals that look a lot like strangely-ticked English setters.<BR/><BR/>The Dalmatian is a screwy breed. Its only purpose was to make gentlemen's coaches look stylish because it had a speckled dog or two walking along with it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com