tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post5443403860810290329..comments2024-03-26T22:16:26.572-04:00Comments on Terrierman's Daily Dose: Doing Right by Pit BullsPBurnshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comBlogger52125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-19444097987882286292015-09-22T23:34:05.450-04:002015-09-22T23:34:05.450-04:00Why don't we put our effort into punishing the...Why don't we put our effort into punishing the stupid people responsible for abusing them and breaking their human or dog trust. We need stronger animal abuse laws. Sterilizing them is not the answer, it's punishing them for coming in to the world with trust for everyone. Most of the time, those people don't deserve trusts and abuse it. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17030811232329583733noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-80835037404652197982014-02-28T03:26:49.342-05:002014-02-28T03:26:49.342-05:00When I think of all the healthy pitbulls being put...When I think of all the healthy pitbulls being put to sleep I get a lump in my throat, its all horrible, a horribly tragedy. I knew "owned" and loved a wonderful pure fighting strain of English Pitbull and can say it was a pure honour, a miracle of an animal. It was all a mistake but I don't regret it for an instant.<br /><br />Would i do it it again? No Im too old at 40 to handle that raw energy, power and athleticism in such a sized dog.<br /><br />The game English pitbull has been bred for hundreds of years not to bite man and now suddenly it's a contemporary man killer and maiming machine. How extraordinarily sad.<br /><br />What went wrong?<br /><br />I don't approve of dog fighting but the English pitbull was intentionally bred not to bite humans. Dogs that bit humans while being handled at dog fight were ordered destroyed, simple and effective method of ensuring these dogs didn't become man killers. Besides no sane handler wanted to be continually at risk of mauling. Then of course they also knew not to put their arm between dogs setting out to fight.<br /><br />I think the fact that there are no longer sanctioned dog fights in some countries has meant the breed has been allowed to go to pieces there in the wrong hands. Nurturing a dog to attack and breeding them heavier and or with the use of other less disciplined aggressive breeds. With full intention of them becoming something they never were, very dangerous to man. Its a crime in itself.<br /><br />How very sad it all is. The worst problems I would expect is high dog fatalities due to the hard wired dog aggression they have also been originally selected for besides being man friendly. The only problem I had with mine was indeed dog aggression, it was uncontrollable. <br /><br />I agree people should be handler certified and have to pass a test with their dogs to prove they are safe. This should be at their expense and conducted annually. The problem is where does that end? All big dogs all dogs that look a bit pitbull...... all dogs?<br /><br />Who knows. It seems the definition of a pitbull might be hard to define these days.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Antonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14041212020431214852noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-6716479672765943022012-10-17T22:47:09.854-04:002012-10-17T22:47:09.854-04:00WOW... most if not all the comments on THIS blog a...WOW... most if not all the comments on THIS blog are intelligent and coherent ... not always found in some responses about PBs. At the moment,because I've posted only links to the daily reports of slaughter and mayhem caused by PB/PB types, I'm getting slammed and some harsh comments even from long time friends. EVERYTHING I've tried to point out in on this blog. I've done rescue for almost 50 years... been bitten 14 times... 9 times by those annoying little Chuahuas, 1 by a Cocker with an ear infection, 1 by the littermate of my Drathaar when I was walking out the door with him 2 by police GSDs during civil rights demonstrations and once by a foster DandieDinmont who turned out to have a brain tumour. One Cairn of mine showed teeth when grooming and got a muzzle after that for grooming.<br /><br />You will not find even near accurate stats on on frequency ratio because of the underground/thug culture that breeds the most violent 'witches brew' of the PB type dog. These individuals never take their dogs to a vet, they are never even vaccinated, much less registered with an animal control office so the best you can do is an guess-timate. You can't even tell about an accurate number of bites. The only thing you can go by is the frequency and severity of REPORTED attacks.... the attitude and response of the owner...most slink away, file bankruptcy or otherwise refuse assume moral much less fiscal responsibility for mayhem their dogs committ...often driving the victim families into bankruptcy. <br /><br />If the number and severity of attacks were a virus, the CDC would have an army sent into each community to eradicate the vectors of the disease. This IS a public health issue.Joanna in Las Vegashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13123142523867683396noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-41732216705499363492012-02-28T20:23:47.511-05:002012-02-28T20:23:47.511-05:00Bite frequency is a meaningless figure. Dachshund...Bite frequency is a meaningless figure. Dachshunds bite a lot, but people are rarely hospitalized. Most serious dog bites occur from "butcher dogs" which include Pit Bulls, Rotts, Dogues, Dogos, Presios, etc. Look up butcher dogs on this blog and you will see some discussion.<br /><br />About 60 percent of all serious bites leading to hospitalizations are due to Pit Bulls, but this type of dog represents only 2-3% of all dogs in the U.S. Again, search this blog -- I have written a lot about Pits in the past.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-72239772434080637072012-02-28T14:40:45.008-05:002012-02-28T14:40:45.008-05:00I've searched high and low and been unable to ...I've searched high and low and been unable to find stats on pit-bull bite frequency in relation to pit-bull population representation in overall dog population. In other words, I'm looking for a way of contextualizing these stats without it being weighted by the number of dogs involved. For example, if Pits outweight Rotties for bite frequency and/or mortality rates, I want to be able to factor total of Pits in circulation (so to speak) versus Rotties. Have you had any luck finding this information? Best, EEhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02069517640150931400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-52004352038130788832010-02-16T15:18:50.214-05:002010-02-16T15:18:50.214-05:00John wants me to know that when he says "I am...John wants me to know that when he says "I am where I am" what he really means is that he does not care enough about the million dogs a year being killed to do actually do anything for "his" breed. <br /><br />Which is exactly what is wrong with the Pit Bull community, and why nearly a million dogs a year are being killed.<br /><br />PPBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-72464006773866664922009-12-07T19:33:20.381-05:002009-12-07T19:33:20.381-05:00What we have here is a moron. Or a drunk. Or a d...What we have here is a moron. Or a drunk. Or a drunk moron.<br /><br />Or as he puts it "I am an owner of a pit bull, and currently have a court case due to it."<br /><br />I'll bet!<br /><br />Good luck with that, LOL.<br /><br />PPBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-26999446469172974622009-12-07T19:07:25.441-05:002009-12-07T19:07:25.441-05:00Ok, people, let's stop with your 'statisti...Ok, people, let's stop with your 'statistics', ideas, and BS that is all found by reading articles and reports by the MEDIA! The media, as anyone with intelligent though should know, does not necessarily report on real statistics and research. If you disagree, I will reference such people as Glenn Beck, Rush Linbaugh, Kieth Olberman, Rachel Maddowetc. Who will all report completely differently on the same stories. Why? Because it is all based on personal opinion and speculation. The same basis used when writing Breed specific legislation. I am an owner of a pit bull, and currently have a court case due to it. I do agree that people must be responsible for their pets, which most people are not, what type of pet it is, is irrelevant. I have done plenty of research on this subject, and seemingly unlike most people commenting here, or someone who wrote this blog, I use valid sources, such as academic journals, research reports, and articles written by professionals in the field. Not the opinion of journalists or fudged statistics. The real rpoblem is not genetics, the only thing genetics have to do with it is:<br />Yes, they are a large breeed and capable of seriously injuring or killing.<br />The question is, does this make them 'inherently vicious'? No, it does not, it just makes it easier for unsavory people to train them to be aggressive and vicious, and the ability act upon this training. People are bred to be contributing members of society, but are most people contributing to society in a positive way? No, because they weren't raised or 'trained' to do so. With your argument that these animal's ancestors were bred for certain purposes will reflect on offspring, people should inherently want to positively contribute to society. Therefore, your argument is invalid and unsubstantiated. Unless, of course, you go with a specieist perspective that we are cognitive beings and genetically superior to these animals. Since humans seem to try so hard to separate us from the rest of the animal kingdom. So what happens if the son of a criminal grows up to be a prosecutor? He should have been bred to be a criminal, considering he is the descendant of a criminal. I can debunk just about any of these myths so many media brainwashed people love to write or post about. My next post here will be an article I recently wrote on this subject, with VALID sources. Anyone compelled to debate this should be prepared with some valid sources, or will you continue to allow the media to control your thoughts?BirrMLhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01475671945378418420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-46753851770424209622009-11-22T11:18:24.199-05:002009-11-22T11:18:24.199-05:00First, good on ya for adopting.
Second, I assum...First, good on ya for adopting. <br /><br />Second, I assume you are NOT disagreeing with the first sentence that there are LOTS and lots of books, web site, bulletin boards, etc. that LOVE to talk about the gladiator history of the Pit Bull. You would not diagree with that, right? Lots of romance there, eh?<br /><br />What you seem to be disagreeging with is that everyone in the world of Pits is a blind fool. I would agree with you there -- not all are. But a LOT are breed blind, and a lot of folks seems to have no idea about the genetic code that exists in work-created breeds. And so they deny the code exits, and the result is predictable: Lots and lots of dogs in shelters on their way to death.<br /><br />A lof of folks love to defend the Pit Bull. What seems to be going on here -- and you have given a small nod to it -- is that folks are looking for a cause, and Pit Bulls seems like a good one. Then, looking for an analogy to help them sell the cause of Pit Bull rescue, they try on the "racism and prejduice" hat. The only problem there is that it does not fit very well. <br /><br />You see, people have not been bred for hundreds of years for aggression. Some breeds of animals have, and Pit Bulls are at the top of the heap. <br /><br />YES there are Pit Bulls without the faintest Pit Bull code in them, same as there are Jack Russells with no prey drive and Border Collies with no herding sense. In the world of pet placement, that is considered a good thing. But if you want to know how often that happens consider this: In the U.S. right now, we kill about 1/3 of all Pit Bulls a year. And why? Because the folks that got those dogs thought they were getting a "PET Bull," but in fact they got a Pit Bull. <br /><br />Consider this: Almost all of the Pit Bulls in your shelter got in your shelter due to the failure of someone who loved or liked the dog. Most shelters are awash with Pit Bull failures -- and the failure is of their FIRST owner to know what a Pit Bull was and is. Now that the Pit Bull is no longer a puppy, it is hard to market. Most people do not want a dog; they want a puppy. And very few want an adult Pit Bull.<br /><br />P.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-58559906106589185442009-11-22T09:51:19.356-05:002009-11-22T09:51:19.356-05:00You say:
"On the one hand, these folks will...You say: <br /><br />"On the one hand, these folks will tell you their dogs have been bred for hundreds of years to battle other dogs, catch wild pig and cattle, kill escaping slaves, and guard prisoners and farm stock.<br /><br />On the other hand, they will tell you that every Pit Bull down at the local pound is as gentle as a lamb, and would never harm a fly unless it has been "raised wrong." <br /><br />HOW COMPLETELY UNTRUE! And I do take offense. <br /><br />I work/volunteer at a no-kill shelter in CT. I love pit bulls, probably because of their underdog status. <br /><br />The first thing I do when working to adopt the many dogs in our shelter is ask "how do YOU feel about pit bulls. If they're not interested, I don't push, I don't try to win them over. I don't pretend that all pits are angels, I don't pretend that they're all ideal for homes with children or even inexperienced adults. (We also don't take in dogs of ANY breed that have shown aggression. That can be a Yorkie or a pit bull.) <br /><br />Please don't categorize owners of PBs and lovers of these dogs as ignorant fools who protect these animals from harm no matter what. Those of us in shelters or ACs have seen the truly damaged dogs, the sadness of abuse and cruelty that some can only imagine. <br /><br />There is no doubt that there are people who do this, but we're not all blind fools. There are also people who protect the aggressive Golden who bit the infant in the face, or the Flat Coated Retriever who has bitten multiple times unprovoked. But no one writes about those dogs or throws them into a bucket. Let's face it: overbreeding of any dog will screw up the gene pool. <br /><br />Each dog is an individual; no matter the breed. It should be evaluated individually, temperament tested, and placed appropriately. <br /><br />I don't believe there is a home for every dog; I don't believe every dog can be saved. There are dogs who are beyond "damaged" and cannot be rehabilitated and safely placed. But I don't believe every pit bull - or every dog - should be placed in a bucket and judged in a generalized fashion.<br /><br />By the way, my crew consists of four rescues: A Border Collie, an Australian Shepherd, a Parson Russell, and a Pit Bull. I know the characteristics of each of these breeds, as I do other breeds. You pick up a little after 48 years. <br /><br />Broad brush strokes and generalizations such as the one you've made can be very harmful. We've seen it done to humans and the impact its had. Let's try not to do this to animals, too. <br /><br />Pibble - http://rescuek9.blogspot.com/pibblehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11420878751922413807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-15852208920797421822009-11-16T14:40:46.634-05:002009-11-16T14:40:46.634-05:00Thanks -- will correct the Horn Lake MS cite.
P...Thanks -- will correct the Horn Lake MS cite. <br /><br />PPBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-8870057748710786622009-11-15T20:49:27.470-05:002009-11-15T20:49:27.470-05:00I want to point out that you listed Horn Lake MS. ...I want to point out that you listed Horn Lake MS. on the map as an area that has bsl, and it in fact does not have any kind of restrictions or special rules for any breed, including Pit Bulls. It used to require Pit Bull owners to be insured with 50,000, but that was dropped over 10 years ago. <br />It still shows up on bsl lists everywhere, but it no longer has any.JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07465763501659002554noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-48308457203798183042009-10-29T15:36:32.959-04:002009-10-29T15:36:32.959-04:00John --
I am not sure what you mean by " I ...John -- <br /><br />I am not sure what you mean by " I am where I am."<br /><br />We are all where we are all the time.<br /><br />We all take the time to do what we think is important.<br /><br />We all have the same amount of hours in a day.<br /><br />As for this blog, you clearly do not read it.<br /><br />This blog worked to help spark a BBC documentary, which worked to change dozens of canine standards in Kennel Club dogs in the UK and Australia. That BBC documentary, in turn, sparked an ABC Nightline piece on the same issue (video of both is in the right margin). Sometimes a spark catches the right wind!<br /><br />But enough about the past. My last five posts have also caught a little wind, as they have exposed the AKC's close ties with puppy millers. Those posts are being picked up by other bloggers now -- more literate and more influential writers than me. Another case of a spark catching a wind.<br /><br />This morning I put up a visual of what is going on on the Pit Bull communuity. Here is it is >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/10/pit-bull-community-fails-pit-bull.html<br /><br />You are where you are but whether you are in Alaska or Nebrask or on a ship at sea, you can effect change.<br /><br />How about take this graphic >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/10/pit-bull-community-fails-pit-bull.html and get it produced as a stencil that folks can buy from you at cost?<br /><br />How about putting up a Face Book page to sell the stencil (with a Pay Pal link) with instructions on how folks can stencil 2,400 Pit Bulls and the message (you get to write that!) on a road in their read. The inlcuded instructions you would send them would explain that folks should work with the City and County and choose roads about to be resurfaced in the next week or so; this is not vanadalism; this is Public Relations and Educational outreside. This is the job of "UNselling" the breeding of Pit Bulls. <br /><br />Paint the road, and politicians will come out to help, and so will other dog lovers, and the Animal Control folks. Reporters will be there to write stories and take pictures. Television cameras will show up.<br /><br />And guess what? You can be the spark for this whether you are in Nebraska, Alaska or New York City.<br /><br />But it requires action. <br /><br />Asking for people to take action is not to give them a "beat down." Funny that you think it is. Funny too that you think NOT taking action will change the situation for Pit Bulls.<br /><br />With that, I am closing this thread. <br /><br />Part of taking action is not wasting too much time with people who have no real interest in making change and who cling to the status quo. I am hoping you are not one of those, but so far I have heard a number of excuses for doing nothing, and seen no real interest in actually taking action. In the world of the Pit Bull, Inaction = Death, and Action = Life. Make your choice.<br /><br />PPBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-78499481248719545142009-10-29T13:42:00.605-04:002009-10-29T13:42:00.605-04:00Jesus, Patrick, enough with the "what are YOU...Jesus, Patrick, enough with the "what are YOU doing about it" beat down ... Your point is well taken, but I am where I am. I could just as easily make the point that your daily attention to this blog is a colossal waste of time if you truly cared about saving dog lives.<br /><br />Describing my list as an "extremely high & invasive regulatory burden on all dog owners" is flawed as follows: a) I'm not advocating a 20-point plan, I'm saying 'take your pick'. b) Only 4 or 5 out of 20 are "regulatory" in nature, and few if any fall into the category of 'high' ... besides, you want action, right? c) I'm not buying your convenient logic that innocent pit bull owners deserve all "the burden" while innocent 'other breed' owners do not ... Can't we just agree that targeting the source of the problems rather than a larger population of responsible owners is the much wiser path?<br /><br />Re your "hose off the blood" trilogy ... First, are you telling me there are no warning signs between nice, peaceful puppy and a dead baby on the driveway? Heed the warning signs, pit bull or otherwise. Second, the entire criminal justice system is based on punish bad deeds, not punish potentially bad deeds. So, yes, if you have to hose off the blood and then punish the dog/ owner harshly, so be it ... works like clockwork in human society every day. If you want "potential for harm" as the new basis for law, you better add your own breed (JRTs) to the banned list, along with about 1000 other different things.<br /><br />Re your dismissal of my dog offender registry, again you see no middle ground, no usefulness? Not all dogs that bite are DEAD ... what planet do you live on? My friends Pom was killed by the neighbors Akita ... and nothing happened except a small fine. Some dogs are volatile and/or display aggression in given situations ... doesn't make them all bad or worthy of death, but neighbors get nervous and need a forum for documenting their concerns. Might help AC build a case against some of these lowlife owners or backyard breeders. Gets the community involved in the solution without burdening AC.<br /><br />Re Diane Jessup ... Don't know her personally but have followed her work for years and read passages from her books. No doubt she's smart & done great things for the breed, but she represents only one facet of PB owners -- a facet which can be easily confused as dubious by untrained eyes (i.e. most politicians and the general public) ... Why? Because explaining to some Joe Schmo what a "working pit bull" is requires just that ... lots of explaining ... and begs the question "Working at what?" ... The explanation isn't likely to end with a bunch of warm & fuzzies about the breed. Jessup is a shining example of responsible ownership, but her devotion to protecting the very trait that so many people find dangerous about the breed, is probably a PR challenge for her and PB advocacy at large.johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379584597920680258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-60907230871749549822009-10-28T19:07:07.002-04:002009-10-28T19:07:07.002-04:00Nice list John! I might support quite a number of...Nice list John! I might support quite a number of these. Of course, I may be the exception. <br /><br />What you have done here is create a list of extremely high (and often invasive) regulatory burdens on all dog owners rather than deal with the problems for your breed.<br /><br />To make a road repair analogy.... <br /><br />Instead of dealing with the pothole in the road in front of your home, you point out that there are potholes all over the world, and your plan of action is to start filling in the oldest potholes first. <br /><br />But about that pot hole in front of your house ....??<br /><br />To put it another way: What have YOU done to get any of these ideas operationalized on behalf of your breed?<br /><br />You are not stupid or inarticulate. You care about your breed. You have ideas. <br /><br />Now use that to lead, or else get out of the way of the local politicians who will lead in your absence.<br /><br />Diane Jessup over at http://www.workingpitbull.com has put it pretty well when it comes to the current state of affairs for Pit Bulls. She writes: <br /> <br />"No other breed has ever faced the possibility of extinction by legislation like the American pit bull. We are in a time of crises. We can regulate ourselves, or we can allow dog-haters to do it for us."<br /><br />Exactly.<br /><br />I am hardly a dog hater. <br /><br />I have spent many years working on behalf of dogs. <br /><br />Not owners. Not breeders. Dogs.<br /><br />So let me bring it back to the real question: What are YOU going to do to help the Pit Bull? <br /><br />What are you doing to get new laws passed? <br /><br />How are you going to work to change the culture?<br /><br />Today about 2,500 Pit Bull were killed because of the failure of so many to take action.<br /><br />Tomorrow it will be the same.<br /><br />So, which of these changes do you think will REALLY work to reduce the carnage down at the pound this year or next or the year after that? Which one of these ideas are you willing to spend the next few years on?<br /><br />It will take lot of time. There is no money or reward in it.<br /><br />But if you do not take ACTION to support an alternative solution, I guarantee no one will care what you think. Communities have heard a lot of talk for a very long time from the Pit Bull community, but they have seen very little action to create, support or implement alternative workable solutions of the kind you suggest.<br /><br />In fact, much of what you have here is typing.<br /><br />"Enforce dangerous dog laws already on the books?" What does that mean? Does it mean we hose off the blood and kill the dogs after the bite? <br /><br />"Comprehensive, behavioral based dog legislation already proposed and endorsed by multiple animal/vet organizations..." Does that mean we hose off the blood and kill the dog after the bite? <br /><br />"[A]ctually removing, rehabbing, relocating, putting down ... dogs that actually show a history of aggression" Does that mean we hose off the blood and kill the dog after the bite? <br /><br />Other ideas are pretty good, but pretty far out there. You want a sex offender-type registry for dog owners? Based on what? If your dog bites a person right now, it is DEAD. If it is just barking next door, however, can your neighbor have you added to the sex offender-type registry? Oh good!<br /><br />You want to make it illegal for landlords & insurance companies to discriminate based on breed? Wow. They have no property rights? Landlords and insurance companies are discriminating based on risk. Insurance companies discriminate based on age, sex, smoking, weight, race. But not on the basis of Pit Bull ownership? Landlords have prohibitions on loud music, outdoor clotheslines, water beds, and any and all pets, but they cannot say they will not rent to someone who has a Pit Bull? How about a lion or a horse? <br /><br />Not all your ideas are half-baked. Some are very good. But they are equally worthless if they are not followed with a LOT of concerted action over years. Are you willing to do that? Are you willing to stand for the dogs? For years? Without pay? Because that is what it is going to take. <br /><br />Ask Diane Jessup.<br /><br />PPBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-24848377304688708872009-10-28T18:13:51.545-04:002009-10-28T18:13:51.545-04:00Yea, 1,000 words from me with no solutions VERSUS ...Yea, 1,000 words from me with no solutions VERSUS an entire Blog from you with no solutions. <br /><br />Oh, wait, your solution is BSL, just with no data on how/why it's going to work and no explanation for why your current position wholly contradicts your 1/12/09 post (where you flatly reject BSL against pit bulls). Hmmm ... what's going on, Pat?<br /><br />But since you asked about solutions ... <br />1. How about ENFORCE dangerous dog laws already on the books? OR<br />2. How about comprehensive, behavioral based dog legislation already proposed and endorsed by multiple animal/vet organizations.<br />3. How about actually removing, rehabbing, relocating, putting down (you pick) dogs that actually show a history of aggression ... Neighbors know which dogs have the behavioral problems, but amazingly years can go by without AC ever investigating ... can't happen.<br />3. How about targeting the source of the problem instead of the entire pit bull owning population.<br />4. How about empowering police to make arrests or issue citations based on something other than witnessing a dog fight, or granting an officer permission to investigate other potential violations based on suspicion of dog violations. <br />5. How about forbidding ex-criminals from housing dogs.<br />6. How about requiring teenagers who wish to handle dogs publicly retain a permit/ID, showing that they have no history of jv and have passed a basic dog ed test. Could even make it an "endorsement" on their school IDs, which they often carry with them anyway.<br />7. How about a hotline or reward program for whistle-blowers (with protection against habitual whistle-blowers).<br />8. How about introducing mandatory "dog bite" education into school curriculum ... as simple as a 30 minute CD ... explain why kids are susceptible to bites, demystify the pit bull, explain the penalties, attempt to break the cultural ignorance.<br />9. How about stiffer penalties for irresponsible ownership ... if they can't pay the fines, make them serve time or do community service. <br />10. How about introduce Prison Dog programs into the community ... Win-Win-Win ... maybe even do school field trips to witness the program.<br />11. How about require mandatory offer/receipt of dog ed information at all S/N clinics, shelters, vet offices?<br />12. How about make it illegal for landlords & insurance to discriminate based on breed without at least an exemption process.<br />13. How about shutting down and banning puppy mills (all breeds).<br />14. How about flagging certain lines or "working" dog breeders ... maybe higher transparency requirements or other trigger events. <br />15. How about asking law enforcement what can be done ... right now, too many cops got better things to do, or simply aren't willing to risk their lives over a dog and a misdemeanor charge.<br />16. How about funding or fund-raising for PSA campaign about dogs (or even pit bulls if you wish). Not opposed to your "unselling" idea, as long as its informational & not fear-based.<br />17. How about a simple community website where people can report problem animals and /or see where the problems are in their neighborhood. Sort of like a sex-offender registry, but less formal and more interactive / educational.<br />18. How about a voluntary donation fee earmarked specially for dog-bite related education ... can be solicited when dogs are registered or at S/N events.<br />19. How about a tax of some sort ... not sure what to apply it to ... but I'm not opposed to paying it. I just don't like the idea of tying it to registration b/c too many people already don't register (for good & bad reasons). <br />20. How about some anti-chaining and "failure to exercise" laws ... I happen to believe failure to exercise is the root of most problems. <br /><br />I have others, but you may not really care at this point. After all, I'm just one of those worthless "pit bull people", right?johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379584597920680258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-73956616648129360102009-10-28T15:09:26.511-04:002009-10-28T15:09:26.511-04:00John, you've typed a 1,000 words on here and ...John, you've typed a 1,000 words on here and still have offered NO solutions or suggestions. <br /><br />None.<br /><br />You have indeed cast the solvable into the abysss of the unsolvable. <br /><br />I do not need to characterize the Pit Bull communuity -- it is a caricature all its own. As noted earlier, just Google "Put Bull Breeder" or "Pit Bull Kennel" and see what you get. I have. Let me know what you find when you do it.<br /><br />P.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-17521666930265428552009-10-28T14:40:33.088-04:002009-10-28T14:40:33.088-04:00Patrick - It's your blog, so you can say what ...Patrick - It's your blog, so you can say what you want, but I came on here to express my thoughts and hopefully learn from someone with an opposing viewpoint. What I got instead was a recurring lecture on how bad the pit bull community sucks and an off topic lesson on immigration.<br /><br />First, I never said X couldn't be solved until Y was fixed, nor did I say the problem was "unsolvable", nor am I one of those apologists who "can't be bothered" with the all the euthanizations & maulings (I suppose even the hard-working pit bull rescue groups don't get your respect). Your repeated attempts to paint us in such ways is offensive and frankly unhelpful to your credibility as a blogger (if that matters to you). <br /><br />I did say that YOUR solution (i.e. BSL, etc.) seemed misguided & oversimplified given what we know to be other societal & political factors at play. Not even your own previously posted beliefs appear to reconcile with this position. In your haste to condemn the PB community and eagerness for change, you seem now to have drifted into the "let's throw shit on the wall and see what sticks" camp. This I find perplexing and suspicious. <br /><br />I, like many pit owners, would like to be part of the solution; but I can't change how we got here nor do I have the man-power or legal authority to do what I think really needs doing. At best, I can work within the system we have and maybe have some impact on the multitude of f#@cked up things that culminate into a pit bull incident. Banning a host of breeds and regulating responsible owners are not on my "good ideas" list, and never will be.<br /><br />You apparently have some magic tough-guy way of policing your own, but I'm still waiting to hear how you would do it were you in my shoes (i.e. as a pit owner in 2009, not in 1950). I do know that that many PB advocates have drafted and pushed for comprehensive, behavioral-based legislation coupled with targeted education and enforcement, only to see those sensible solutions summarily dismissed ... why? well that's another story, isn't it.<br /><br />To answer your last question, Yes, I do care, and No, I don't enjoy the status quo. Admittedly my first priority is raising an exceptionally good dog (which I have by every measure) and protecting him from political ass-wipes and their followers. Beyond that, I advocate where/when I can and am educating myself on what actions can be taken to fix a very complex problem plagued by competing interests & rampant ignorance. Maybe not the type of activism you respect, but I'm not exactly sticking my head in the sand either. Wherever this all leads, I will have a voice, it will be intelligent, and it will be heard.johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379584597920680258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-15682305079691347852009-10-28T05:26:16.573-04:002009-10-28T05:26:16.573-04:00John your core argument is an old one: that we ca...John your core argument is an old one: that we can do nothing about X problem until we solve some (much larger) Y problem.<br /><br />For examples, some folks suggest we can do nothing about illegal immmigration until we deal with all of the hunger, poverty and unemployment in the developing world.<br /><br />Others suggested we can do nothing about street drug markets in our inner cities until we deal with all of the poverty, hopelessness, joblessess, and broken culture in in our cities, and strengthen crumbling families to boot.<br /><br />But you what? Neither of those are true -- these were just convenient lines to take solvable problems and toss them into the abyss of unsolvability. Every country in the world controls its borders and does a pretty good job of it compared to the US. Changes in US immigration law enforcment made after 2002 are only now being implemented, but illegal immigration is now going down for the first time in history. Similarly, changes in law enforcement in the 1990s resulted in decline in the number of street drug markets in most of our inner cities. No you never eliminate anything (including murder and rape), but you can reduce the numbers.<br /><br />We can do the same for Pit Bulls. <br /><br />Instead, Pit Bull owners could not be bothered with doing anything to save the dogs from the killing chambers. They could not be bothered with preventing people from being lacerated by these dogs placed in the wrong hands.<br /><br />Most of the anti-breed specific legislation arguments are nonsense.<br /><br />You want to know what is breed specific? I will tell you: the deads dogs at the local shelters are breed specific -- most of them are Pit Bulls. No one wants them, and most of the cages are full of them. More and more dogs are coming in every day, bred by fools who claim they have rights and no responsibilities. That is very breed specific<br /><br />You want to know what else is breed specific? I will tell you: the dog that rips the face or seriously savages the legs and arms of someone is breed specific. And to be more specific, more than half the time the dog doing the damage is a Pit Bull type dog. <br /><br />Both of these are breed specific problems, and everyone in the "gets it." <br /><br />The failture of the Pit Bull community to patrol its own breed and to suggest real solutions for these real problems means that others are stepping in to fill the gap. <br /><br />Sorry, but no one is waiting for a magic wand to appear which we can wave to get rid of all povety, knuckle heads, and fools. <br /><br />Clearly, such a wand is not needed anway; we did not have Pit Bull problems in the 50 or 50s, did we? No, we did not. Back then we had enforcement. Back then people knew they had responsibilities and they were not yet making fanciful rights claims in order to try to escape them.<br /><br />So yes, the comments section is begging: What are YOU DOING to change the problem? What are you doing to change the culture of your Pit Bull community? What are you doing to keep Pit Bulls out of the death chambers at the local shelter? <br /><br />Don't just tell me your theory of change: Tell me what you are DOING to create change. Because if you are not doing anything then you either: 1) don't really care, or; 2) are simply trying to derail what others are doing in order to return to the status quo of doing nothing (which means one million dead Pit Bulls a year and thousands of ripped up people). <br /><br />P.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-69004762159894804972009-10-27T21:04:05.515-04:002009-10-27T21:04:05.515-04:00Appreciate the response, PBurns. Quality dialogue...Appreciate the response, PBurns. Quality dialogue on the subject is hard to find. A few responses to your comments:<br /><br />1. You say you don't have the answers for pit bulls, but in fact your previous posts suggest you do -- your de facto solution is heavy regulation (breed specific bans, mandatory this, required that, etc.) ... Make everyone jump thru a series of hoops and eventually every thing will work itself out, right?<br /><br />2. The problem I see with your solution (aside from the mountain of evidence that says it doesn't work) is that worst offenders either don't care, won't comply, or simply stay one step ahead of an under-funded, under-enforced, and sub-harsh code. Meanwhile, guys like me (who aren't part of the problem) become burdened with paperwork, fees, and the anxiety of knowing the city could order a Denver-style round up on us on the whim of some f#@king politician. Sorry, bro, I'd rather donate a $1000 to HSUS, then pay a $30 pet registration (which now puts my dog on the death rolls). People really need to stop with the "you got nothing to worry about as long as your dog is ok" argument. <br /><br />3. As my original posts reads, the problem largely rests with a group of people whose faults reach well beyond pit bull ownership. So, let me get this pro-BSl logic straight: We as a society have failed to break generations of ignorance, poverty, criminal activity, drug use, human & animal abuse, and general disregard for the law ... BUT all of sudden a new pit bull law and AC officer Barney Fife are going to clean up the pit bull problem. This is what I mean when I said you're oversimplifying the solution and why BSL is so misguided.<br /><br />4. I applaud your efforts to keep the JRT bad apples in check ... Unfortunately, our opportunity to nip that in the bud has come & gone. We might legitimately be able to shut down some websites or shame people into backing off all the macho crap, but again we (unlike you) are dealing with a criminal element, or at the very least a damn defiant one; there's also the issue of that pesky Constitution, property rights, and freedom of speech. I'm wondering if there are possibly some lessons learned from what the Dobe or Rottie crowd did years ago?<br /><br />If you wish to continue this dialogue, I'd be happy to post some of my own solutions ... My original intent was to see, under a hypothetic JRT scenario, if you'd revisit your BSL position and offer some more constructive solutions, but it sounds like you're pretty dug in.johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379584597920680258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-75324003059403253332009-10-27T17:30:28.051-04:002009-10-27T17:30:28.051-04:00I don't have the answer for Pit Bulls, but I d...I don't have the answer for Pit Bulls, but I do know what the answer is NOT: doing what we are doing right now.<br /><br />What we have now is breed bans AND lots of dog bites by Pits, AND a million dead pit bulls a year. <br /><br />And what is the Pit Bull community's answer for THEIR breed? <br /><br />So far, it's to talk about what NOT to do, rather than what to do. <br /><br />And the result, of course, can only be described as a FAIL. <br /><br />I think if you read a little more on this blog, you will see that we DO have fools in the Jack Russell and Patterdale Terriers communities, and that we DO patrol things pretty tightly. <br /><br />Click on the link in this story to go to the JRTCA web site and see what they say about NOT getting a Jack Russell terrier. <br /><br />The JRTCA also runs print ads in EVERY major dog publication every month saying the same thing: a JRT is NOT the dog for you. <br /><br />Where is the analog for Pit Bulls? Not there! <br /><br />Instead, it's page after page of Pit Bull breeder ads, each selling swagger and testosterone.<br /><br />Instead its web sites that say Pit Bulls are a perfect family dog and are no different from a Standard Poodle. Anyone who says different is a dog-racist!<br /><br />And what is the result? Simple: a million dead pit bulls a year, scores of thousands of serious bites a year, and a push for breed bans from coast to coast.<br /><br />Go to the Pit Bull bulletin boards and web sites and see what you get. What you will find are folks selling break sticks, bragging about fighting lines (yes, I know what I am reading) and otherwise celebrating the worst. Is everyone doing that? No, of course not. But no one edits it out when some do, do they? This kind of sly celebration of dog fighting is not just tolerated in the Pit Bull community, it's considered the norm! <br /><br />Go to Google and type in "Pit Bull Breeder" or "Pit Bull Kennel" and see what you see. There's the macho crap again, the chained dogs, the celebration of fighting ("purely for historical purposes"), the chest-thumping graphics, the wannabe dog fighting community, etc. <br /><br />Pick the first 10 pit bull breeders and write down the laguage used and clip the graphics. What is being said? Who is this designed to attract?<br /><br />This is YOUR dog and YOUR community. <br /><br />So the question comes back to this: What are YOU doing to fence up and send out a different message?<br /><br />In the JRT community, we beat people hard when they need it. I do it on this blog as regular readers know. See this post as an example >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2009/07/laughing-and-cringing-at-foolish.html <br /><br />Did that post work? It did -- the pictures are gone, and that fool (a wannabe dog fighting man in a small town in Iowa) is marked and (more importantly) a positive culture has been framed.<br /><br />In the JRT community, we teach people how to treat the dogs, and how to talk about them too. <br /><br />But what about the Pit Bull community? <br /><br />Not so much. <br /><br />Pit Bull folks seem to be waiting for others to clean up their culture.<br /><br />And I assure you that they will. <br /><br />There are too many dead dogs and there are too many mained people for society not to step up. <br /><br />The short story is that your canine community has failed in a spectacular way, and your community's response has been timid, ineffective, and accusatory. Instead of accepting responsibility, you have denied it.<br /><br />And so the question is turned back to you: What are YOU going to do to protect your breed and change the culture?<br /><br /><br />P.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-81618155885221939842009-10-27T16:11:11.656-04:002009-10-27T16:11:11.656-04:00Mr. Burns - First time to your blog and found your...Mr. Burns - First time to your blog and found your pit bull comments both refreshing and disturbing. I happen to fall into the camp of let's advance the debate from "Are pit bulls inherently dangerous" to "What can we do as a pit bull community to reduce the number of unwanted incidents?". My Amstaff is of course well bred, properly trained & socialized, and holds damn near "hero" status in my neighborhood ... But I need not travel far to find some idiot redneck or inner-city punk mishandling his poorly bred, untrained, & undersocialized K9 status symbol. Remarkably, many of those dogs still turn out ok (a testament to the breeds), but several do not, causing problems for the rest of us. On this point, we probably agree. The question is ... what to do about it.<br /><br />Your solution seems to be along the lines of let's make an exception and go ahead with breed bans and mandatory fixing. Sort of "the pit bull community can't police themselves, so we need to do it for them" solution. You're right, there is not enough responsibility in the PB Community, but I'm surprised a man with your intelligence would believe the solution is so simple. At the root of the "pit bull problem" is entire class of humans with generational ignorance and/or criminal motivations ... I'm afraid your breed ban & neuter laws aren't going to fix that. In this case, the pit bull breeds take the fall, but, hypothetically, what if Jack Russells became the new fad ... tenacious as shit and easy to hide from the law, overbred, oversold, increasingly represented by the worst low-lifes on earth. What then? Are you going to be receptive when I fire off a blog about how Burns & the rest of the Jack Russell community can't police itself? Let's round up Burn's JR's and kill them (or chop off their nuts) because he can't keep the criminals, thugs & hillbilly breeders out of the breed ... Just a temporary solution until we "get the supply down". Come on, is this the best solution a man with your intelligence can come up with?<br /><br />I genuinely want to explore ways to reduce pit bull incidents, but most of the problems are NOT coming from educated, law abiding dog owners ... rather they stem from an element of society whose problems are much greater than what kinda dog they own. Your solution seems to ignore this reality and would likely not even work as a stop-gap measure. Please don't mistaken my comments as "the criminals will break the law no matter what we do" ... I'm simply asking whether you, upon further reflection, might have some creative solutions to a rather complex problem.johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379584597920680258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-79107323307211211132009-10-17T14:14:20.265-04:002009-10-17T14:14:20.265-04:00Josef, I am familiar with the history of the Pit B...Josef, I am familiar with the history of the Pit Bull, and the simple truth is that this is not a breed, but a type. Some are in registries, some are not, and size varies widely depending on intent and purpose. <br /><br />For the history, see here >> http://terriermandotcom.blogspot.com/2006/05/what-hell-is-american-staffordshire.html <br /><br />The effort of the Pit Bull community to define the problem away by saying "that's not a Pit Bull" fools no one and does not serve the interests of the dog. People who know dogs know a Pit Bull when they see one, just as they know a Jack Russell when they see one. Some may be better or worse examples of the dog, and some may be larger or smaller or fall under a different name (a Parson Russell Terrier or a Russell Terrier for JRTs), but there is no denying the dog, is there?<br /><br />Yes, I know that some Pit Pull owners admit the game-driven nature of the breed, but many do not. Only a few years in dogs, and based on a sample size of one, these folks have decided that all Pit Bulls are as gentle as lambs and all are safe unsupervised around the family chihuahua and the family baby. What happens next, in a small but predictable number of cases, is told in statistics and story.<br /><br />All dogs are capable of biting other dogs and other people, and the same aggressive strand (which is partly fear-based it should be said) that makes a breed dog-aggressive is the same exploded code that can make it human aggressive as well. Again, we do not have to guess about this; what happens too often is told in story and statistics.<br /><br />A Pit Bull web site notes that "for every 1 Pit Bull placed in a loving home there are 599 killed. Shockingly, that statistic unfortunately does not exclude puppies!" This site goes on to note that more than a million Pit Bulls a year are killed in the U.S, and that more than 200 a day are killed in Los Angeles alone. <br /><br />So please, let's NOT talk about responsibility in the Pit Bull community. There is far too little of it, and the piles of rotting dog carcasses tell that tale. This is a dog that is over-bred and over-sold, and which the Pit Bull community has failed for far too many decades. <br /><br />P.PBurnshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05781540805883519064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-18369205880029859582009-10-17T12:55:03.181-04:002009-10-17T12:55:03.181-04:00PBurns, usually I can agree with a lot you say in ...PBurns, usually I can agree with a lot you say in your blog and I have learned a great deal from it but with this post I have to disagree.<br /><br />PitBull owners are very well aware of the fact that our dogs are dog agreesive and very prey driven. We constantly try to stress this point to new owners that this breed isn't for everyone <br /><br />and you should think carefully about wanting to own a very driven, active and dog aggressive dogs. Whoever thinks that these are just "any old dog" are very mistaken and would think that about any working breed.<br /><br />I don't, however, believe that these animals are human aggressive (as a majority) there are a few true game bred dogs that are man biters and you have people raising their animals for protection that teach them human aggression but as a rule these dogs were breed to absolutely love humans. <br /><br />These also aren't large dogs. 30-60 pounds is a medium sized breed and when you begin to get consistently larger animals you are no longer talking about an APBT.J. Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10654303709250349613noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684843.post-35283015949989526452009-10-16T10:50:16.509-04:002009-10-16T10:50:16.509-04:00And on this morning's front page of our local ...And on this morning's front page of our local paper, The Calvert Recorder, a report about pit bulls and an attack here this summer on an oil delivery man. No link up on their web site yet, but the synopsis is that the man was making a scheduled delivery, was handing the property owner her bill through the front door, when the dog raced up the stairs, past the owner and attacked the man. 100 stitches to his face and a lot of lost work time later this man now has fear on the job. The article profiles some other cases in Southern Maryland, pit bull attacks on humans and other dogs, and talks about what the local jurisdictions are doing about dangerous dogs. <br /><br />SeahorseSeahorsehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00133454380103294333noreply@blogger.com